Janos Szabo, new rector of the National University of Defence Studies © Marton Szilvia

"My father said he wouldn't pay for my higher education." Because of this, he ended up studying to be an aeroplane mechanic in Szolnok. He was not an aviation enthusiast, however. His thesis was "an instructional film explaining the workings of the hydraulic mechanism of a helicopter motor." He nonetheless aimed for the highest grades. "I couldn't swim, even though they told me that would stop me from getting top grades. I brought loads of swimming pool tickets and a swimming manual, and five months later I passed." He nonetheless asked to teach social sciences in place of technical subjects. He was permitted to do this from 1984 at the Zrinyi Miklos Military Academy. After the regime change, he was sent to Brown University in America, after which he was named an employee of the Strategic and Defence Research Centre, gaining a doctorate in war studies along the way. He was appointed a professor at the Academy in 1996. Two years later, he accepted the post of state secretary in the Ministry of Defence. In 2000, he was dismissed by the incoming Liberal-Socialist government. He returned to the National University of Defence Studies - the Academy had meanwhile been rechristened - where he headed up its doctoral department. From this springboard he was recently appointed rector of the institution.


HVG: Budget cuts are on the agenda. Your predecessor was called Szabo. We can't help suspecting that you were appointed so they could save money by only changing half the nameplate on your office door.

-That's not a bad idea. It's a shame you didn't mention earlier, because I'm sure that wasn't the main factor. Not least because I was the only candidate.

But this sharing of names is something of a theme in your life. You served as a deputy state secretary under a minister who had exactly the same as you. Didn't this cause some embarrassment?

-He was the older and more senior of the two of us, so I was asked to find a way of differentiating my name from his. I experimented with inserting the initial 'B' into my name, but it turned out that would cost me 180,000 HUF, and then everyone in my family would have to change his or her documents. That's when somebody suggest that I become Professor Szabo, and the minister became Dr Szabo.

We'll assume it wasn't the identical names that you left government?

-8M HUF of ministry money ended up in the account of the journal Kis Ujsag , which was published by the Smallholders Party, who also ran the ministry. The Opposition questioned this. Since I was in charge of press affairs, they asked me, and I told them to ask Szabo, the minister. He then refused to talk to me, saying I had been disloyal.

You've come a long way from your early alma mater. You never wanted to be a fighter pilot? Or an astronaut, like your contemporary Bertalan Farkas.

-While I organised the welcoming reception held for Farkas Bertalan on his return, I never even thought of trying for that career. I'm a contemplative type of person. For me, even the surface of the globe is attractive.

Many agree with you. Perhaps only in the Air Force Officers' college are you in a minority. But you stayed there to teach. Why was that appealing?

-Many people asked me to stay. They said: "We've had enough stupid officers; we need clever people."

At the same time, social sciences were hardly a key part of Socialist defence theory. We understand that, despite being a party member, you ran into difficulties because of your first published book, entitled Social Effects in the Armed Forces. What was their concern?

-I demonstrated that there were many areas in which the army was not achieving its stated goals. I explained the anomalies by reference to social factors. The director of Zrinyi Books reported me for this. The group commander came to visit me and instructed me to remove the passages in question from the book. Basically, they cut my balls off.

That kind of treatment could well have proven enough to take you away from the Academy to the Jurta Theatre, just a few streets away, where some of the people who later drove the regime change were starting to gather.

-News of the changes didn't come to me from the Jurta. I was tasked with organising several conferences, and at meetings in Veszprem and Tihany I spoke to everyone from Imre Pozsgay and Elemer Hankiss to the founding fathers of Fidesz.

Your career continued flawlessly. What achievements can Hungarian defence thank you for?

-Building up a system of human resource management is certainly my achievement. Sociology is teamwork of course. I introduced the system of giving equal credit for all the authors of a given study. Before, the head of the department got all the credit. I changed this.

That's quite an achievement. But were you never accused of being a man of theory, not of action?

-A good question. I could deflect it by saying I was never asked to serve actively, but I'll be honest and say I never missed the action. I did enough as a researcher. I'm not interested in the everyday.

And you were appointed rector in any case. The army is a model of hierarchy. To the world, it will mean something if you are ranked up with the president and the generals on 20 August or if you appear somewhere else in the hierarchy.

-What kind of a question is that?! I've never even considered this question. I was always happy to stand wherever protocol dictated.

What about when you failed to be elected a corresponding member of the Hungarian Academy of Sciences in 2003?

-You don't apply to be an academician. You have to be invited. I was nominated once, and I regard that as an honour. I have two more opportunities, because you can be nominated three times. Either you get it or you don't. I hope my scientific contributions hold their own among the other sciences.

Why did you retire before the age of 50?

-When I was appointed state secretary, I had to retire in order to hold on to my professorial chair. Afterwards, when my service as state secretary ended, I couldn't go back into service, so I continue to receive a pension of 90,000 HUF, while my students retire with a pension of 240,000 HUF.

ANDRÁS LINDNER - ZOLTÁN HORVÁTH